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Old 12-30-2011, 08:29 AM   #61
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Just because I think its Unnatural for my friend to be gay , in NO WAY means that I respect him the least bit less .

Unless there's some secret reason , I see no reason for this overkill of Bills posts.
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Old 12-30-2011, 08:59 AM   #62
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Hate to barge in on this intelligent conversation, but why trash BillS?
She has opinions too!
Woody, of course Bills has the right to his opinion but Bills oviously has no contact with gay people and his judgement obviously comes from fear.. not sure if Bills has childred but what if one of his children were gay and the child knew of Bills opinion of gays. wouldnt that be sad that he would judge his own child or would his opinion be different?

and I dont really see anyone trashing Bills.. only other giving there opinions as well..and perhaps hoping that Bills may soften his stance and or rethink his judgements..
thats what intelligent conversations looks like...
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Old 12-30-2011, 09:22 AM   #63
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Hate to barge in on this intelligent conversation, but why trash BillS?
She has opinions too!
Not bashing Woody just voicing my disagreement with an opinion.
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Old 12-30-2011, 09:37 AM   #64
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as long as they're decent human beings.
3 pages, and one so simple line that brilliantly explains my point of view - well done and kudos!
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Old 12-30-2011, 12:10 PM   #65
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Hate to barge in on this intelligent conversation, but why trash BillS?
She has opinions too!

No worries, Woody. Just sharing opinions respectfully.

Debates would be pretty boring if everyone agreed...lol.
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Old 12-30-2011, 02:59 PM   #66
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Hmmm, Wife and I spent Xmas dinner with 8 people, including us, that had 2 lesbians and 2 gay men. You have made an incorrect assumption about me......Now, I favor gay marriage rights and benefits for partners as I believe both are constitutional. Surprised? My point, AGAIN, is simply that gay sex relations are unnatural. It is you all that are adding to my point. Are some of you so far gone with PC that you believe 2 men, conducting anal intercourse, is natural? Do you believe a child will be the result? Deal only with "NATURAL" please and leave your embellishments aside....BTW, happy New year to you all from us and my gay sis-in-law and gay brother-in-law...!
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Old 12-30-2011, 03:02 PM   #67
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Rox, reread my comments please. I never said people must produce children in order to have a meaningful relationship. You've overreached in your reply...
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Old 12-30-2011, 03:10 PM   #68
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Your opinion is shared by many.

I would suggest you consider that it is simply unnatural to you and how nature has made you. That doesn't mean that it isn't natural, in terms of what nature provides.

I'll give you that hetrosexuality is extremely important in terms of the prepetuation of a species. But homosexuality isn't something new. It's been a part of humanity thoughout history. We managed to multiply in spite of that.

What troubles me is the terrible emotional pain that many homosexuals and their families have had to endure simply because of a biblical passage, or a social stigma, or the discomfort some hetrosexuals feel towards it. That seems horribly wrong to me.

Most people I know, who originally shared your perpective, changed their minds once they had an opportunity to get to know homosexual individuals.

Again, you can't make someone a homosexual any more that you can make a homosexual "straight".

For my part, I can't relate to being sexually attracted to a member of my own sex. It's not in my "nature". But it's unreasonable to think everyone has to feel like I do to be accepted as an equally valuable human being.
Brewster, Something being old doesn't make it natural. Does Cain's killing of Abel make murder natural? "Old" doesn't mean "natural". Let me put you squarely on the spot here, and don't dissemble now: Are gay sex relations NATURAL? Yes or no please.....Is a man's insertion of his penis into another man's anus natural, or not? Answer specifically please...This is my simple point...
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Old 12-30-2011, 03:23 PM   #69
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Brewster, Something being old doesn't make it natural. Does Cain's killing of Abel make murder natural? "Old" doesn't mean "natural". Let me put you squarely on the spot here, and don't dissemble now: Are gay sex relations NATURAL? Yes or no please.....Is a man's insertion of his penis into another man's anus natural, or not? Answer specifically please...This is my simple point...
It's two consenting adults and it fits...seems kinda natural to me.

By this definition, oral sex is also unnatural?
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Old 12-30-2011, 03:34 PM   #70
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Brewster, Something being old doesn't make it natural. Does Cain's killing of Abel make murder natural? "Old" doesn't mean "natural". Let me put you squarely on the spot here, and don't dissemble now: Are gay sex relations NATURAL? Yes or no please.....Is a man's insertion of his penis into another man's anus natural, or not? Answer specifically please...This is my simple point...
I think I can take this one, and not being judgmental at all but it is natural. Earlier I linked to a wikipedia article that discusses homosexuality in the animal kingdom. By extension if it's natural for a percentage of animals to be homosexual then it's just as natural for a percentage of the human population to be homosexual.

I'd be willing to debate my reasoning as to whether it's natural or not. As you can see I am using a comparison to nature. I would be willing to listen to your reasoning that it isn't. Fair enough? And for the record that's my honest opinion and not because I am trying to be PC. lol
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Old 12-30-2011, 05:13 PM   #71
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Brewster, Something being old doesn't make it natural. Does Cain's killing of Abel make murder natural? "Old" doesn't mean "natural". Let me put you squarely on the spot here, and don't dissemble now: Are gay sex relations NATURAL? Yes or no please.....Is a man's insertion of his penis into another man's anus natural, or not? Answer specifically please...This is my simple point...
Oh sure, use a biblical reference on the atheist...lol

Yes, I think that gay sex relations, as described, is natural. For homosexual males.

I think it is natural for human beings to seek to do things that provide sexual gratification, excitement, arousal, emotional and physical pleasure. If you are a gay male, anal sex seems to me to be a natural thing to do.


I think the difficulty here is each individual interpretation of "natural".

If you are saying that the only natural sexual behaviour is that which involves the intent to reproduce then I have to disagree. That would describe mastrubation as unnatural, for instance.

Usually, when someone says something is "unnatural", the implication is that it is wrong. It's a behaviour that should be corrected or at least refrained from doing. Is this what you understand unnatural to be?
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Old 12-30-2011, 05:26 PM   #72
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Hmmm, Wife and I spent Xmas dinner with 8 people, including us, that had 2 lesbians and 2 gay men. You have made an incorrect assumption about me......Now, I favor gay marriage rights and benefits for partners as I believe both are constitutional. Surprised? My point, AGAIN, is simply that gay sex relations are unnatural. It is you all that are adding to my point. Are some of you so far gone with PC that you believe 2 men, conducting anal intercourse, is natural? Do you believe a child will be the result? Deal only with "NATURAL" please and leave your embellishments aside....BTW, happy New year to you all from us and my gay sis-in-law and gay brother-in-law...!
Yes, that does surprise me. And you knew it would!! lol

I can understand that you might see my motivation as being PC, but believe me, I'm not. For instance, if I was concerned about being politically correct, I sure wouldn't have started this thread, critising religion and taking a shot at a politician who was obviously being PC sucking up to the evangelical vote.

Happy New Year to you and your family, as well.
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Old 12-30-2011, 10:28 PM   #73
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By this definition, oral sex is also unnatural?
Nope and it's not sex either... at least accoding to my good buddy Bill!

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Old 12-30-2011, 10:59 PM   #74
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Nope and it's not sex either... at least accoding to my good buddy Bill!

Jamie

LMAO.... good one Jamie.

And our buddy, Jim. "I did not have sex with that mop"...lol
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Old 12-31-2011, 07:05 AM   #75
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LMAO.... good one Jamie.

And our buddy, Jim. "I did not have sex with that mop"...lol
But we know him better than that... the mop is still traumatized!

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Old 01-02-2012, 02:59 PM   #76
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A picture is worth a thousand words.... lol
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