Avoiding "Ripoffs"

[V]

On the whole, people in Cancun have been remarkably honest and straightforward in their dealings with me, including, amazingly, taxi drivers. (I have heard what can happen to tourists, caught unawares regarding the standard fares.) But, I haven't owned property here, nor a car, so I haven't had to deal with home or auto repair, nor home improvements, and those two areas of life are fraught with peril, around the world.
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There have been only a few situations in which I became aware of being ripped off, or that someone was trying to rip me off. The first, is in ticket sales, at ADO and the ferry landings. It has always involved a matter of failing to return the correct change, which I only noticed later; or, attempting to do so, that I noticed at the time.

I think I've learned to announce how much I'm handing over, then to keep the change on the counter in front of me, and in plain sight of the ticket salesperson, when counting it. Doing this at the ferry in Cozumel, the ticket agent first handed me an additional 100 pesos, when he saw I'd stopped counting, but hadn't moved away. When I continued to look at the money, he added another 100 pesos, and I moved on (I had paid with a 500).
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The other situation involved a restaurant scam which I didn't fully understand until I'd left the restaurant. It required failing to charge for an item which should have been included in the bill. I paid the bill (generated by a cash register, as typical) when it was presented, and added a tip. Some minutes later, as we were about to leave, the waiter rushed over and announced, "Oh, I forgot to charge you for "X". You need to pay "Y"". Thinking he was probably right, I handed him the amount requested, and we left. Later, it occurred to me that he hadn't presented me with a second bill, for the omitted amount. This was not a rip off of me, but of the employer/owner.

Under similar circumstances, in the future, I will not pay without a cash register receipt, for the additional amount.
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Another place in which a ripoff has occurred or was attempted, in my experience, has been at the national and state parks, which charge an admission fee. Two methods have been employed in an effort by the employee to rip off the park service of funds needed to maintain the parks- and pay the salary of others. The first involves simply not handing over a ticket, after tickets are paid for, and pretending that is normal. The second was even more "amusing". People will often discard these tickets as they leave the park, sometimes in the bathroom waste bins. In my case, when I demanded a ticket, the agent rushed to the bathrooms. When he returned, he presented me a ticket. It took me a few minutes to realize he had not had an urgent need to relieve himself, and understand what he'd done.

In these situations, I will always demand a ticket, and watch to see that they are giving me a fresh one, off their pad.

[th@bvg]

Perhaps there should be a Hall of Fame and a Hall of Shame on this forum to educate the unwary.

Personally I think that most here are honest and fair but the sheer number of people who, "try it on," mean that you always have to be on your guard.

Cafe/Restaurant bills are always worth very close scrutiny. Food is generally good value but the completely random way that some cafe's add - "tax" and gratuities upto 15% means that you have to be on your guard. This is quite sad.

I used to regularly go to a well known cafe/restuarant in the hotel zone and felt that because I went so regularly I did not need to check the bill. I always used to leave a tip for no other reason, than it is the done thing. Anyway one day I did the bill check and saw 10% had been added. I asked if the 10% was for gratuities and the waiter said no, it was tax. I asked what tax it was and he got quite irritated and said that I always paid the tax but could not enlighten me further. Lesson learned. Be careful not to pay double gratuities !!

[V]

Just last evening, I saw an example of what might be the thing th@bvg is talking about, at my favorite restaurant.

I was with a group of visitors to Cancun, which I guess changed the rules.

For the first time, an item was added- 15%, for a "p. xxxxxxxxxx" (unfortunately, I don't remember the second word.) But, I assumed the "p." was for "propina", and they were just trying to disguise it a little. Could have been mistaken, I didn't ask.

[Jim in Cancun]

Many restaurants all over the world charge the tip automatically for groups over a certain amount of people. It might have been that--or not.

Also, this may--or may not be--one of the many times like I have experienced when I may think I am being "ripped-off" when I don't really understand either the language, the culture or the custom or some other "reason" behind something.

[V]

Be careful not to pay double gratuities!!

I suppose it's a stretch, Jim, to include this "complaint" in a thread devoted to "rip-offs".
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I've always been uncomfortable with tips included in a bill presented me whether in Mexico, or not. I much prefer to have the matter left to me, and feel including it is a little presumptuous; however, I know it's done many places (but nobody bothered to consult me!).

What was different about the experience at "my" restaurant was that they had never added this sum before. Since we usually tip, I wasn't too concerned about it, just surprised, and mildly annoyed to see it.

[Isla Zina]

There's another way to lose money daily for lack of being familiar with the culture. You buy something in the US, the bag and the change are handed to you. Here the changes is handed to you. Not the bag. Many times I have walked away. Few have called after me! But the purchase is there when you return.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by Jim in Cancun

Also, this may--or may not be--one of the many times like I have experienced when I may think I am being "ripped-off" when I don't really understand either the language, the culture or the custom or some other "reason" behind something.

Have to agree, many 'rip offs' arent really rip offs at all, just a lack of familiarity or language issue.

I've found that the longer I live here the less I get ripped off, and can spot a real rip off a mile away.

[CancunGringa]

Things I watch for and have happened to me:

- Incorrect change (frequently)

- Items on tab I did not order (occasionally)

- Being told the amount owed at restaurant y price goes down when I ask to see the actual bill (a handful of times, in touristy places)

- "Gringo tax" (occasionally)

- Tax added to bill at restaurants, when it was already included in the price of the menu items (a handful of times, in touristy places)

- Valet parker stole spare tire, didn't realize it until I turned in the rental car and was charged over 2000 pesos (well, I figure it had to be the valet parker because the trunk wasn't broken into, someone opened it with a key)

[T.J.]

Two things come to my mind:

1. A couple of years ago, I ate at the Crab Shack or Crab House or whatever it is called. The wonderful restaurant in the HZ. It was a party of two. As many of you know, this place is anything but cheap.

In this case, everything was wonderful and the service deserved a substantial tip.

The bill came and I pulled out the amount shown thereon PLUS the tip, again more than "normal". While waiting for the waiter to pick up the payment, I glanced at the bill and found 15% had been added. I quickly gathered my money and asked to see a menu. Nowhere did it mention a mandatory tip. When the waiter came back I asked him to bring the a capitan to the table. I introduced myself as a Cancunense and my companion as one of the managers over the Concierge Dept at BBG.

Then I asked about the forced tip. The manager said it was not policy and that I was free to tip what I chose. There was an exception of a fixed fee for larger parties. I told the capitan that the food and service were wonderful but that I resented the undisclosed rip off attempt. I told them that my tip was going to be $500 and showed them the money that I had taken out of the folder. Yep, it was special and good wine was involved. Since he gave me the option, I changed it to $100 or about 5%. I told him that I would never be back and that I would tell my experience to anyone who asked and that I would put a warning on the message boards. My companion was leaving Cancun and moving to DF and said she would tell the Concierge staff of this tactic. Of course she would not have done that had she not been moving. I often wonder if this fine waiter lost his job, but I will NEVER go back to find out.

Of a much lesser bite was the Orange Juice stand at Mercado 23. I had been buying 2-3 liters per week from the lady who seemed to always be on duty when I went there. The price was $7 per liter. It jumped to $8 which is normal with seasonal produce. Only a few weeks later it went to $9. Then I went and the lady was no longer there and a guy was running the stand. $14 he says. I thought he was nuts or kidding me. So I told him I was not buying at that price. I went back every week or, not for the orange juice, but I always stopped to see if the price had come down. It was always $14 and I always thanked him and left. Then I see this little Mayan lady with 2 liters, both in bags, as opposed to the bottles. I asked her how much was the OJ and where she got it. $12 and at the same stand. I went and asked the price and it was $14. Those who know me best know that I can get ballistic over things like this and ballistic I got. I told the guy he was a rascist (in English as I didn't know the translation), and a thief. I had to be a bit careful as he had the big knife for cutting the oranges in half. But I gave him everything I had as loud as I dared. When I went back the next week he was gone. My price became $10 and has remained there for months AND I get the same price for my choice of bottles or bags. Go figure. Heck I feel better just writing this post.

I usually stick to my guns on this type of stuff. I had 3 meals at Applebee's and every one was terrible and I never went back and never will. My friends went to Carls Jr and Paseo Cancun and had a breakfast item (no longer sold there) that was served with white gravy. It tasted bad and they discovered it had ranch dressing instead of gravy. When questioned, the manager said it was white and looked like gravy so they used it after not having any gravy. No offer for another item without the "gravy" a voucher, a refund or anything. Guess where else I will never spend a centavo, or 10 since you can't spend only 1.

[V]

Isla Zina, you just reminded me of something that used to happen to me, but doesn't any more (sounds like Steve's comment about what happens after you've been here a while). It involved my beginning to notice that I hadn't made it home from the supermarket with everything I'd purchased.

Here's how it works. While bagging the groceries, the bagger slides one or more of the items you paid for slightly off to one side and perhaps somewhat hidden under an unused bag, or other handy object. If you don't notice, it's his for the keeping; and, if you do notice, it looks innocent, because the object is not completely hidden from sight until you walk away. When you get home you may, or may not, notice that something is missing.

When I began to realize this was happening, I started watching the baggers, and it hasn't happened to me, since.

[th@bvg]

Originally Posted by Steve

I've found that the longer I live here the less I get ripped off, and can spot a real rip off a mile away.

Which is really what is so uncomfortable about the whole thing really and why the tourist and the unfamiliar get targetted.

[CancunGringa]

TJ - Is this where you buy your orange juice? :lol:

[Steve]

I'm amazed at how many places here are still using a 10:1 pesos to dollar rate. Now that is a rip off.

[violet0905]

for those of u who club ,if you buy ANYTHING at classico in plaza peninsula ,they will include a tip, that gets worse if u pay with a credit card cuz the charge gets done immediately without a chance to say anything!...The service is nice but I dont enjoy being told how much to tip!!None does !!

Also at the airport mexican restaurant in the international airport here in cancun..., Berry Hill ,they added an insane amount for tip ,the guy I recall brought us two ceasar salads, 4 perrier water bottles, and some stuff my friend's kids ordered and didnt even eat ....and dessert ,bill was up to 900 ,thats fine..but then he added 20% for tip !!

thats all i remember now ,if i do remember more ill post it

[T.J.]

Cancun Gringa,

Funny picture. Where did you get that one?

Haven't seen you out and about for a while. I hope you are doing well.

T.J.

[V]

What was different about the experience at "my" restaurant was that they had never added this sum before.

Turns out, this is still the case. I was there, last evening. This time, I made a point of telling them I lived here, and the extra 15% was not added to the bill.

What's the deal, are tourists just cheap when it comes to a tip, and the waiters think they have to protect themselves? (I know some nationalities have a different tipping culture, such as the Germans, who think it's sufficient to just leave the "change".) But, I still appreciate having the matter left to me.

[GONZO]

I believe I tip well 20%+ and if I get a bill with the 15% added thats what they get. Their loss.

[Life_N_Cancun]

So basically the moral to these stories is; ALWAYS check your bill closely..

Some places like to slip in a "servicio" charge of 10-20% and then claim that its NOT the tip, or that you are obligated to pay it. YOU ARE NOT. You are required to pay the price on the menu, but if there is no mention of a "service charge" (check the bottom for microscopic print) then they cant legally hold you to pay anything above that posted price.

The law also requires that the "I.V.A." tax be included in the list price, so if the "I.V.A." is added on top of the list, then again.. be on guard. Some places, especially the touristy ones, do (Illegally) list their prices without tax, to make them seem lower, but they generally make it clear somewhere with the statement "tax not included" or "plus tax".

Another thing to watch for are bars that will throw a few extra drinks on your bill, hoping that you are too intoxicated to notice or lost count (which certainly happens to some of the heavier drinkers among us)

To be fair, places that receive lots of European clients, might have the "servicio" added to the bill, not as a way to scam you out of money, but as a way to insure that their (horribly underpaid) waiters get tipped by the customers who are not accustomed to leaving gratuities. But if you are ever told its "not" the tip, then you will know that you are being lied to.

If you find yourself at odds with an establishment a mention of the word "PROFECO" will back 99% of them off if push comes to shove. (For those that dont know, PROFECO is the consumer protection agency in Mexico, and they can and do shut down places that don't play by the rules.)

All in all, I accept it as a part of life here that I will often get the "gringo rate" on services, but being vigilant will prevent most problems in your everyday transactions. You have to remember, the average tourist is blowing through ridiculous amounts of money while they are here and are legally drunk for most of that time, so unless the establishments know that you are not just another tourist, you can expect some shenanigans from time to time.

[T.J.]

Originally Posted by V

What's the deal, are tourists just cheap when it comes to a tip, and the waiters think they have to protect themselves?

Part A - Yes V, but it's fault of the damn Brits; and

Part B - Yes, but the Mexican culture is different in the approach to dealing with this issue. Because wages are so far below that of the countries to the north, it is my feeling that a tip from every customer is far more important to a Mexican's ability to feed his family than to an American waiter who gets stiffed no matter what the reason. The approach should be either to put a tip on every check, and disclose it on the menu, but give the guest the right to speak to a manager if they feel that the service does not warrant 15%.

A better approach, more palatable to me, would be for the damn restaurants to put some ink in their check printers so that you can read them and put in English and Spanish that the Tip is NOT Included. Then, when the check is presented, it shold have that sentence circled to call it to the attention of the guest.

One of everyone's favorite waiter, Felipe from Calypso, often builds such a rapport with his customers that he gives his big smile and says something like "Hey guys, the tip is not included so please leave me a good one."

To try to sneak it onto the bill and by the guest is just plain wrong.

I used to do what Gonzo does. I too tip 20% or more and if they forced 15% on me then that was what they got. I TOLD (past tense) the waiter, especially if it is not disclosed on the menu that "I was going to tip you $150 but since you put $90 on the bill that is all you are going to get. After the Crab Shack experience I decided to punish the waiter for arbitrarily telling me how much was going to pay him.

Amendment to Part A - Tongue in cheek. LOL. Jaja, etc. I love all my British buds.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by T.J.

Part A - Yes V, but it's fault of the damn Brits

Nahh, we're not cheap.

Just that we are used to service staff making a liveable wage (minimum wage in the UK is around $10 US or 130 Pesos an hour) so tips are not expected back home - restaurant owners have to give a decent days pay for a decent days work. Brits that dont very often venture to countries such as Mexico and USA that pay slave labour wages just aren't used to the tipping concept.

Kind of like you guys don't tend to use Pesos when you come to Mexico, because the USD is world currency. Right ?

[T.J.]

Steve,

Don't forget that I amended Part A, as follows: Amendment to Part A - Tongue in cheek. LOL. Jaja, etc. I love all my British buds.
God forbid I should offend anyone. Jaja.

But when I was in London a couple of years ago I did notice that the Brits certainly did not discourage, and sometimes actually subtlely encouraged, tipping by me, an obvious American. Thank goodness my daughter had been studying there for 10 weeks already and eduecated me quickly.

They should be well paid there. A $10 hamburger in the states, like at a TGI Fridays for example, was 10 GBP. Looks ok to a kid on dad's credit card but the exchange rate was about 2x1 then so it was equivalent to $20 US. Now, that was the real education, although I knew it was coming.

I love it when I see Brit tourists not tipping in Cancun when they can buy a beer for roughly 1/7 the price it England. I do admit that the beers are far better in England, even though so many people there are all about the Belgian Stella Artois. Too bad Costco only offered that for a short time.

Cheers,

[th@bvg]

I must admit to finding the whole tipping culture really confusing to the point of being unsettling.
This seems to start with the argument that the wages are pitiful and therefore tips are essential. The pyschological off shoot of that is that I am rich, you are poor, but dont worry I will give you some of my money?......... That does not fit well with me at all.
My personal opinion is that tipping should be a reward for effort over and above the call of duty and not an expectation. If the the problem is poor wages, why not get that addressed and then deal with the rogues who try to con extra money with tips on the bill disguised as tax and an expectation for a tip as well.
Of course bringing Mexico into the first world, with first world wages, might just have unwelcome consequences. Mexico could well become a more expensive place to vacation, but surely the rights of the local Mexicans come over and above the rights of tourists to have a cheap vacation.
Brits used to go to Ireland for a cheap week-end away and descend on Spain for a cheap sunshine and Sangria holiday. Neither of these places are cheap anymore - far, far from cheap. But the Brits still go to Spain and it is still the UK's favourite sunshine destination.

[CancunMole]

Originally Posted by T.J.

Part A - Yes V, but it's fault of the damn Brits; and

Part B - Yes, but the Mexican culture is different in the approach to dealing with this issue. Because wages are so far below that of the countries to the north, it is my feeling that a tip from every customer is far more important to a Mexican's ability to feed his family than to an American waiter who gets stiffed no matter what the reason. The approach should be either to put a tip on every check, and disclose it on the menu, but give the guest the right to speak to a manager if they feel that the service does not warrant 15%.

A better approach, more palatable to me, would be for the damn restaurants to put some ink in their check printers so that you can read them and put in English and Spanish that the Tip is NOT Included. Then, when the check is presented, it shold have that sentence circled to call it to the attention of the guest.

One of everyone's favorite waiter, Felipe from Calypso, often builds such a rapport with his customers that he gives his big smile and says something like "Hey guys, the tip is not included so please leave me a good one."

To try to sneak it onto the bill and by the guest is just plain wrong.

I used to do what Gonzo does. I too tip 20% or more and if they forced 15% on me then that was what they got. I TOLD (past tense) the waiter, especially if it is not disclosed on the menu that "I was going to tip you $150 but since you put $90 on the bill that is all you are going to get. After the Crab Shack experience I decided to punish the waiter for arbitrarily telling me how much was going to pay him.

Amendment to Part A - Tongue in cheek. LOL. Jaja, etc. I love all my British buds.

Oh, Felipe!!! I remember him from way back when, when he worked at Hard Shell Taco for Chris P. What great times we had there and with Felipe and his magic tricks entertaining the kids... and us!

[Windknot]

If it makes you feel better, go ahead and tell these restaurants how you're going to "report" them as having ripped you off. But my experience has been that the Mexican people don't give a second thought to "the future" In fact, I don't think they're even taught the meaning of the word. All they care about is TODAY.....and this is by no means reserved solely for the restaurant business....it's the same for most Mexicans who provide a service...like your carpenter who doesn't show up for work when he says he will.

The latter I think is more of a "cultural" thing and the Mexican people are used to it. We "foreigners" should probably learn to accept it, if for no other reason than hair retention and the prevention of ulcers. The restaurant thing and other related incidences seem to apply only to us foreigners. (Gringo tax, etc.) However, it is widely believed that many restaurants in Mexico, are nothing more than money laundering fronts for the Narcos, and they couldn't care less what kind of bad press they receive. Their books are going to show "filled to capacity," whether or not a single person patronizes the place. Just MHO.

[pocodinero]

Would you consider the Airport Shuttle or Taxi (from the airport to the hotel zone) a "rip-off." Are these companies part of some kind of Mafia? How is it that they all charge such high rates? How come someone doesn't come around and offer $15 per carload instead of the $45 - $70?

[RiverGirl]

Would you consider the Airport Shuttle or Taxi (from the airport to the hotel zone) a "rip-off." Are these companies part of some kind of Mafia?

Taxis have to have specific permission to be allowed to collect passengers from the airport. And that permission is not cheap or easy to get. That's why they can all charge top dollar for shuttle services.

If you want cheap then take the bus from the airport to the downtown bus station. Then you can take any normal taxi anywhere.

[Steve]

Originally Posted by pocodinero

Would you consider the Airport Shuttle or Taxi (from the airport to the hotel zone) a "rip-off." Are these companies part of some kind of Mafia? How is it that they all charge such high rates? How come someone doesn't come around and offer $15 per carload instead of the $45 - $70?

Leaving aside regular taxis who aren't supposed to pick up at the airport, I think that's a very good price for a private return shuttle service. Especially when you can have as many as ten people per van for just $70.

When you consider a return transfer involves around 2 hours of a drivers time, gas for say 30 miles, insurance, maintenance, purchase/lease cost of vehicle, depreciation, office staff to take reservations and co-ordinate the service, affiliate commissions, computers, uniforms, cellphones, licences, permits etc. I dont know how they manage to offer it at such low prices.

Well I do actually, the companies dont make much per trip but rely on volume. Word of mouth, publicity and reputation being key to achieving the volume. It's probably one of the few businesses in Cancun that is truly market driven - raise prices lose custom, lower them and gain. It finds it's own level.

[Windknot]

Hell, I didn't even know taxis weren't supposed to be at the airport...I see tons of them when I'm there. Do they all have this "special permission?" BTW, how much is a taxi fare from CUN to (say) the Oasis Americana on Tulum?

[Laura Mapchick]

Regular taxis can take people TO the airport, but they cannot pick up passengers FROM the airport.

The airport has a taxi company (Greenline) that can take people from the airport to their hotel. A private taxi to the hotel zone is about $58.00us one way. People can take a shared van from the airport to the hotel zone for about $16.00us per person one way.

To downtown the private taxi is $56.00 and shared van $16.00us
I could be a couple of dollars off, these are last year's prices.

I take the bus from airport to downtown for 40 pesos

The private transfers like E-plus are a pretty good deal compared to the airport's taxi/shuttle.

Originally Posted by Windknot

Hell, I didn't even know taxis weren't supposed to be at the airport...I see tons of them when I'm there. Do they all have this "special permission?" BTW, how much is a taxi fare from CUN to (say) the Oasis Americana on Tulum?

[Windknot]

WOW!!!! Here in Veracruz, it's about 15 USD for a taxi to the airport, and the distance from downtown is the same, if not a little further. Thanks for the heads-up.