Crime in Cancun

[Epic]

Originally Posted by rawkus

I have had some issues here, but nothing close to when living in Australia.

In two years living in the same flat:

*3 attempted rapes (since August 2009)

*3 stabbings(failed robberies...)

*4 random assaults

*4 break ins in our building, one which resulted in fairly near death(and rape..) for our young girl who manages the flats...

*Pet killers(a.k.a. Psychos)

*Been attacked by 3 guys with baseball bats and rocks(!!) when asked them to "please turn down the volume of your car stereo"... Blasting shitty banda at 4 am, waking up the ENTIRE neighborhood. Oh yeah, cops arrived and told me to "go home and go to sleep".

All this in Calle Cielo?

[Life_N_Cancun]

I found this interesting.. although I have a feeling that some of the countries are fudging their numbers.

Here is a breakdown of Mexico by crime.

& the US just for comparison.. keep in mind the US has more than 1 in 100 already incarcerated so that will affect the numbers since the US has more people in chains than any other country on the planet! Yet somehow there is still crime going on?! Guess more prisons will need to be built and even more harsh sentences to make the problems go away.

Edit: FYI I think some of these numbers are out of date.... below are some wiki links with (presumably) more up-to-date figures.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of..._homicide_rate

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Mexico

Second Edit: Top 5 Most Dangerous Cities in the world 2009
1. Mogadishu. Somalia
2. Ciudad Juárez
3.Caracas. Venezuela
4. NEW ORLEANS Tied for 3rd with Caracas according to other sites, 2nd on sites that don't count Somalia! Why haven't I received a travel warning about that from the State Dept?

[V]

All interesting to read. I thought the name of the thread should be changed to the above, but Steve solved that problem by splitting the thread.

Steve's is a very sober, sensible analysis and where most people would find themselves, trying to live successfully, in Cancun, or anywhere on this planet.

In five years, my car was burglarized twice, in Dallas, Texas. I was cautious when walking on the streets, and cautious when driving- in a place where a traffic dispute could lead to gun play, every fifth driver possessing a firearm hidden under the front seat.

[rawkus]

Originally Posted by Epic

All this in Calle Cielo?

Yep.

The dudes who attacked me were in the pinkish-building. You can ask the guard on Calle Cielo(the old man who patrols at nights...)

Same dudes, accompanied by 2 women, also beat up two by passers some 2 weeks after my incident. Bats, bottles and rocks = neanderthals?

The week after they took off. Haven't sen them since, but I think I still have pictures of their car that I took the same morning when they went berserk, ha ha

3 of the break ins have been on the ground floor(quite logical) - they entered from the back, so we all went together and bought a metal gate and installed a light.

The attempted rapes are in the park, so not necessarily at our building. But yeah, the park is tiny and I have heard most of the shit going on, so I run outside to help.

People tell me not to do so, considering the risks, but if I were in the same situation, I sure as h*ll would want someone to assist.

The last assault (my downstairs neighbor, a middle aged lady...) occurred just 3 weeks ago. She got stabbed in the right arm and in the back when running away. They never got anything, plus she never carries cash.

Just some months ago, a woman who refused to let go of her bag, was slashed in her hand with a machete. Obviously she let go...

A lot of people blame the construction workers who occupy the opposite side of the park.

In two of the break ins, special tools were used to remove the protection bars, then they removed the windows, part by part(the crappy windows that are divided into pieces and you have to turn to open... "Hurricane proof" I believe they are marketed as..?) and the guys left building material(dust, concrete pieces etc.) behind...

Pet killers were just 1 week ago when we found the 5th cat with a crushed head... Sick f*ckers.

They are also putting out poison - lets see how long it takes until a human kid eats it...

I still "fear" the cops the most in our park... They simply take whatever they can.

They ALWAYS tell me that its a "requirement to carry my FM3 at all times"... BS I say - I have a drivers license, curp, Swedish ID(multilingual). etc.

Most people seem to be more annoyed by them than the actual hoodlums.

I would assume one would not notice half of the things here if one doesn't wake up/run outside.

My wife doesn't wake up, but I do really easily.

"Funny" that this still isn't close enough what I experienced in Australia

[RiverGirl]

...but it's clear that something has obviously changed in your life.

Well I don't live under a rock. A lot changes in one year.

I found a bag of heroin on the beach, a big bag, among a ton of empty plastic bags, and I learned that that area is a drop off location for drug runners. So now I don't feel safe going there, even though it used to be one of my favorite beaches.

The bodies of 3 murder victims were found in a parked car on a street where I walk my dogs. I ran with one of my dogs the morning the bodies were found, so I think I may have actually run right by the car with the bodies in it, along the sidewalk. Talk about creepy.

And I was run off Isla Blanca by 12 guys with machetes. So another of my favorite beach areas is restricted now.

All that happened in the last year, or less, actually.

Meanwhile I've been reading the paper, paying attention to things here, and my knowledge of what's really going on has increased. So yeah, I feel less safe now than I did a year ago, and I have good reasons.

Steve - I know that you know a lot about my personal struggles. And while I may be somewhat unhappy these days, for reasons I won't bring up in public, I'm not more paranoid about my safety in Cancun because my personal issues. That's not it.

If anything it's the opposite. If anything I'm less happy here because of what I've learned in the last year about crime here. Some of my personal discontent would dissipate if I hadn't seen so much bad shit here, and if I didn't understand so much about the organized crime here.

I wish I could go back and undo all this learning. But now I don't even feel safe on my favorite beaches here.

[drewp]

I do want to report a robbery in Cancun. I arrived with $500 and left with nothing. Damn shot girls!!

[V]

The bodies of 3 murder victims were found in a parked car on a street where I walk my dogs. I ran with one of my dogs the morning the bodies were found, so I think I may have actually run right by the car with the bodies in it, along the sidewalk. Talk about creepy.

Predicting what our emotional response will be to events in our lives is tricky business, and sometimes it takes less to set us off, than at other times. For you, it sounds like these recent experiences have sensitized you, emotionally, where they may not have, at a different time in your life, under the same circumstances.

In some countries, people will mark houses and rooms in which unfortunate events have occurred, or people have died, and it can be hard to get people to live there, or stay in those rooms. We recognize this as superstition, though we, too, may be "creeped out" at the thought- as you apparently found yourself, after learning that people's dead bodies had been found on a street you like to use.

In the end, your response is a species of superstition, too, as I see it. Your neighborhood did not become more dangerous as a result of what happened there, any more than your favorite beach did, when you found the bag of drugs on it. Feeling it is less safe doesn't make it so, any more than another feeling safe there makes it more safe.

As I said earlier, I believe this thread is less about what we're aware of than how we respond to what we're aware of: those who feel unsafe, personally, are never comforted by others saying it is safe, or seems so, to them.

Mexico is, and always has been, a crime ridden place, just as most other places in the world are: no country is crime and corruption free, but that thought can't comfort you either, if you are dealing with a powerful aversive emotional reaction to a place, and time.

[RiverGirl]

So because I used the word "creepy" you think that my sense that Cancun is more dangerous than I previously thought is due to my own trauma?

Aren't you playing an elaborate game of blame the messenger?

I've lived here for almost 7 years. My knowledge of Cancun and its history and its goings-on has increased naturally in that time, as it would for anyone who is paying attention and who is interested in this place. Over time I've developed an accumulation of experiences and knowledge which now make me understand clearly that there is a lot more going on here than one can see with the naked eye. And yes, I feel less safe, though I still walk my dogs at all hours. But more I feel that Cancun is much closer to a kind of brink of chaos than I previously thought.

Perhaps I'll save my breath for a more sympathetic audience.

[V]

Aren't you playing an elaborate game of blame the messenger?

Well, no, Rivergirl, because I didn't think the message surprising: I was more surprised you were surprised to discover there is a lot of crime in Mexico.

...you think that my sense that Cancun is more dangerous than I previously thought is due to my own trauma?

I don't think so, anyway. I was referring simply to the three "crime" related things you spoke of experiencing in the last year. As for other traumas you may have experienced, as perhaps referred to by Steve, and known only to your friends, I have no knowledge.
_______________________

Rawkus, I'm impressed at your willingness to take on the "bad guys", when the situation calls for it. You can do a lot of good with that attitude; and, I agree with you, I'd be grateful for someone to came to my aid if people were trying to get physically rough with me.

However, I'm a little askance at your willingness to live in what is- by your own description- an extremely rough neighborhood! My neighborhood is also rough to live in, but that's from dogs barking at night....
_______________________

Many years ago, when I was a young professional, criminologists were beginning to understand that a very small number of criminals could commit a lot of crime and make a situation, bad as it was, seem worse than it was by suggesting that there were many criminals afoot. What they discovered was that young men who had decided to make committing crime the way they would earn their living could be just as "hard working" as others that showed up for work everyday; that is, if they were assaulting people, they might assault several a day, if they were burglarizing cars they might hit a good number of them a day, if burglarizing houses the same thing, creating the appearance of a "crime wave". Thus, it's conceivable that many of the assaults and other crimes you described were committed by the same few people who had chosen to operate in your neighborhood- not that that makes it any better....

[rawkus]

V: The thing is, that this is not at all considered a "bad neighborhood" - quite the contrary.

My "problem" is that I wake up from the slightest of noise(Good luck living in Mexico, right?), so I always run outside to see if, A: Anyone is in need of help/assistance and B: It comforts me to know whats going on outside my window. Not that what I may see will comfort me as such, but Id rather see it with my own eyes that having to hear the gossip about it.

From what I understand, its not the neighborhood itself, but all the crap that passes through it at night, looking for opportunities to steal, rob, rape etc.

Its central, has two big avenues just around the corner(Tulum and Bonampak), making a "hit and run" fairly easy. The park lights have been off for quite some time(mostly different sections of it rather...), making it even easier and more tempting. To all this, you add the amount of cars(many nice ones) parked, creating a very tempting spot to steal a vehicle and head straight to Bonampak, thus escaping police, whom if even bothered to come at all, will be here in anything from 30 mins - "never"...

I like our neighborhood, but really believe that much can be improved, even with small funds.

Its just the will to do it thats lacking when it comes to the municipal...

[V]

Yeah, Rawkus, now I see. We had a similar situation on one street I lived on in the U.S.

There was a public park at one end, and an "entertainment center" at the other, where our residential street intersected a commercial street. There were terrible problems with noise, bottles and trash thrown in our yards, cars vandalized and burglarized, etc. We took several steps to deal with it. A group of the men from our street went to the park and demanded ID of the young people gathered there: they protested mightily, but relented when confronted with a superior force. This "harassment" kept up from night to night until the young people decided we were all crazy, and found other places to hang out. In addition, we got permission of the city to close the street, and walled off our street where it entered the commercial street, leaving us living on a "dead end" street. It was all quiet, after that.

That "foot traffic" through your neighborhood is enough to account for everything.

[Epic]

@Rawkus, its funny that i live less than 100meters from you and still have no idea who you are, and i never knew that all these things happened on our quiet little street called cielo! I am a Heavy Sleeper, don,t run in the park & my Apt faces the street so things that occur around the park are something i am unaware of.

A problem my street faces is indeed a lot of foot traffic due to the proximity to the entrance of the Hotel Zone & the both collective taxi spots located on each side, one on Bonampak (to Z.H.) & the other in Tulum (To Airport).

I honestly suspect that the construction workers (Maybe not all of them) are responsible for 80% of all thefts, they have the tools, opportunity since they sometimes live on site & can keep tabs on your property & learn your schedule.

[rawkus]

Epic: If you are up at 6am, you will see me walking dogs

Most of it is in the park, not the parking in the front.

Since they started the constructions, it has gotten worse.

Not necessarily blaming the workers(they even helped us chase down 2 thieves), but Im sure a lot of the break ins are due to these guys. Its never "smash and grab" - its always "neatly" done, with tools.

My ground floor neighbors flat has been hit twice. Laptop, jewelery etc.

Worst? She had her underwear(!!) stolen right in front of her eyes.. Two guys reached inside through the safety bars and took them. This was before we blocked off the access to the back...

Stuff happens, believe me.



Late 2008 I witnessed one of the most daring attempts EVER:

Two young guys climbed up the side of the pink/peach colored apartment building opposite ours.

They used the window-type AC`s as steps and reached the 3rd floor, pushed in the mosquito-screen and entered the flat...

I witnessed it all and was putting my runners on...

Just 2 mins later I heard a man screaming, angrily.

One of the guys ran out through the same window and started to climb down.

The other one was pushed out through the same window by the man who lives in the flat

A hard thump on the ground.

I ran out and they started to run away through the park, but Im guessing the second guy was hurt from the fall, and it was easy to catch him and knock him over.

A neighbor from across the park called the cops, and bot of us held the "kid" down until they arrived. They showed little mercy and started punching and kicking him until handcuffing and throwing him in the back of the car.

The other guy got away...

This all happened in the middle of the day, at noon!!

[Gringation]

I have to agree a bit with everyone, here.

As Rivergirl says, there's a lot of crime here in Cancun. My house has been broken into twice (2 different houses in the same neighborhood), a neighbor was raped at home during the day (on the other side of the wall where my bed was), and I just got some copper wires stolen. My boyfriend was mugged at knifepoint once, and my brother-in-law three times.

Definitely more crime than I ever saw in Richmond, Virginia, where I grew up. I'd never even come close to being a crime victim until I moved here 5 years ago, and even then, all the breakins happened in the past 2 years (when I moved into a new neighborhood).

I also think that it's very unlikely you'll be raped, murdered, or kidnapped unless you're involved in something higher up (every incident here that I've heard of, such was the case).

What DOES piss me off is that the media plays it up as dangerous for tourists!! I may feel worried about finding my belongings strewn about when I get home, but I never feel as safe anywhere as I do in the Hotel Zone. You'd have to be pretty stupid (or drunk) for something bad to happen to you there.

To sum up: Scared of robbers and those damn dogs in my neighborhood, plus the lying American media. Nothing else.

[coby]

Originally Posted by V

That "foot traffic" through your neighborhood is enough to account for everything.

I think this has been the key for us. We live in a zone which I would presume based on previous experience to be a prime 'target' area; we straddle the line between the tourist haven (hotels and 5th) and the rest of the standard city. Almost everyone who lives in this area is a foreigner and we all have plenty of electronics and similar for the taking.

But we haven't had one incidence and none of our close neighbors has either. That is in stark contrast to other friends I have in the city (mostly in similar zones), who've suffered all kinds of unfortunate encounters, namely, break-ins and theft. The only big difference, is that we live on a 1-way street that only exists for a single block, and where the intersecting [1-way] streets loop around. As a result, we have very light vehicle traffic and even less foot traffic. We are close to everything and on the way to nothing. Seems like the perfect stymie to general street crime. *Knocks on a whole lot of wood*

Burglary and general break-ins are the only kind of crime that has ever worried me here, and admittedly, there are some nights where I don't sleep well when the rare, suspicious vagabond is out and around. As far as violent crime goes, my stature might be a significant buffer to most would-be criminals (although I'm a big teddy bear.) I always make my presence known and have never had anyone remotely approach me in a threatening manner.

That said, Laura has been bothered occasionally by someone following her or harassing her. Whenever this occurs, she'll just give me a call and I'm there in a snap and the people in question either vanish or once, received a stern warning from myself. That doesn't happen too often anymore, however, be it by luck, coincidence, or whatever.

[Epic]

@Rawkus: Way too early for me!!

I am curious since all these i got robbed once & my neighbor got mugged with a weapon of some sort stories being posted.

Does anybody have something they can use for self defense or protection? I have a Pepper Spray, a Baseball Bat (Gift but handy), Taser & a couple of years of Martial Arts Training (am quite rusty but still remember how to fight dirty).

[Gringation]

pepper spray!! 60 pesos at Marti, in the camping section

[Life_N_Cancun]

Originally Posted by Epic

@Rawkus: Way too early for me!!

I am curious since all these i got robbed once & my neighbor got mugged with a weapon of some sort stories being posted.

Does anybody have something they can use for self defense or protection? I have a Pepper Spray, a Baseball Bat (Gift but handy), Taser & a couple of years of Martial Arts Training (am quite rusty but still remember how to fight dirty).

I know in certain areas of town the thieves wouldn't dare reach their arm through someones windows bars, for fear of a machete taking it off. As much as I hate hearing barking dogs all the time, I'll admit they do a good job of keeping the casual thieves away from your house. Pepper spray isn't a bad idea, but unless you have it in your hand ready to go at all times, it probably won't do you too much good. Likewise a taser (unless its the pistol sort that fire at distance) is even more unlikely to help since it requires good contact with the person, and a well charged battery. Those tacky personal body alarms are probably not a bad idea for the ladies who are out and about alone, even if nobody responds just the sounds will make most attackers realize that they are potentially attracting too much attention.

The only instance that I've had out and about was shortly after I arrived here walking in the Crucero area around dusk... a guy walked up to me and showed me a little pistol (25cal or something) at the time I thought he was trying to sell it and just told him "no gracias" and kept walking... I've since realized he was probably trying to rob me but I just wasn't interested. LOL

Other than that I joined the "I was robbed" club last year when someone (I assume with a fishing pole or something) fished about $2,000usd worth of jewelry and things off of my counter though the kitchen window. Since then, I've moved anything of value to the other side of the room, so unless they have a 12 foot pole its out of reach, I also don't leave things really visible anymore. All in all, I figure he was just an opportunistic thief who got really lucky and of' course its the sort of thing that can happen anywhere. I've had my house burglarized and my car broken into in the States, so here is no different. I'm sorry to hear the stories about rapes and robberies that have hit so close to home for some of you, but unless you're going to lock yourselves in a panic room forever all you can do is be vigilant and keep yourselves out of those situations as best you can.

[V]

Gringation wrote:

I never feel as safe anywhere as I do in the Hotel Zone. [Ed.-emphasis added]

Definitely concur with that, plus tourists are at very little risk when doing the usual tourist things, and staying in the usual tourist places, in Quintana Roo.

To raise the risk level to what us "locals" are talking about, you'd have to live in the local parts of town, or go off on your own a lot, outside the tourist areas: even then, the chances of something happening would be low- but would be somewhat increased.

For those who like to keep things nice and safe, and still let your hair down, you can't beat the hotel zone.

[kathy_caribe]

Originally Posted by Epic

oh and someone broke into my car at COSTCO & stole my stereo!!! I am still without tunes & my singing is still really bad.

The only place we have EVER had anything stolen from our car was when we were parked at Costco, waiting out Dean.

[RiverGirl]

To insure safety of your personal space I think it makes sense to live on a dead end street here. And to have a guard and/or gated access. You also do not want to live across the street from a park here, since the park is where people will sit innocently while they case your house and clock your movements.

We bought our house because we made friends with the guard on our street and realized he was doing a great job of interrogating every single person who came down the street. He was a watchdog. He retired and we now have two younger watchdogs, who carry clubs and whistles. And we don't have break-ins here.